Nov 16, 2022
Ryan Gibson is the President, Chief Investment Officer and Co-founder of Spartan Investment Group (SIG). He has organised over $250 million of private equity for Spartan’s projects. Ryan has experience managing and developing SIG projects in challenging markets. For SIG Ryan is responsible for Investors relations and capital raises for projects.
In this episode we talked about:
Useful links:
https://spartan-investors.com/
E-mail: Ryan@spartan-investors.com
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-gibson1/?trk=public_profile_browsemap
Transcriptions:
Jesse (0s): Welcome to the Working Capital Real Estate Podcast. My name's Jessica Gall, and on this show we discuss all things real estate with investors and experts in a variety of industries that impact real estate. Whether you're looking at your first investment or raising your first fund, join me and let's build that portfolio one square foot at a time. Ladies and gentlemen, my name's Jess Fraga. You're listening to Working Capital, the Real Estate Podcast. My guest today is Ryan Gibson. Ryan is the president, chief investment officer and co-founder of Spartan Investment Group sig.
He has organized over 250 million of private equity for Spartan's projects. Ryan has experienced managing and development of s i's projects in challenging markets for Sig Ryan, who's responsible for investor relations and capital raises for projects. Ryan, how's it going?
Ryan (49s): Good, good, thanks Jesse. Thanks for having
Jesse (51s): Me. Yeah, pleasure. The pleasure is mine. Thank you for being on. Really interesting. Today we're gonna be talking a little bit about your background, what you do for Spartan, and I think we're gonna dive into self storage and some of the, you know, the different applications of self storage and maybe demystify some of the, some of those topics for, for listeners that are not as familiar with that asset class. But why don't we start from the beginning. You're at Spartan now. You mentioned prior to the show you had some friends not too far from my neck of the woods.
How did you get started in, in our industry or, or was it in a different industry and you and you came over from there?
Ryan (1m 32s): Yeah, I was kind of over by your geographical side of the, of the United States in Pennsylvania was where I went to college. But actually I had a background as an airline pilot. Flew for about 17 years and then transitioned into commercial real estate investing. And the way that the kind of, the way that it happened was I actually met my neighbor who ended up being my business partner. And so kind of a unconventional way of meeting a neighbor, one of the houses for sale next to me came up and I wanted to really get the buyer in there and I convinced my neighbor to this guy to buy this house next door to us.
And then he convinced me to start a business. So it was a nice exchange. And then we just started flipping houses and building condos in Washington DC and that was kind of where we got our start. And then we really loved the economics and the, the overall business thesis for self storage. So we jumped into self storage as soon as we could and we built one of the largest, 40th largest self storage platform in the United States. So super excited about, you know, the industry and, and everything that it's done in general with self storage investing.
Jesse (2m 43s): So do you still fly or was that, was that a clean break?
Ryan (2m 47s): Yeah, still get some flying in from time to time, especially privately. But yeah, mostly a clean break from the airlines, so yeah.
Jesse (2m 54s): Right on. Yeah.
Ryan (2m 55s): So
Jesse (2m 56s): In terms of the, the work that that Spartan does, is it, is it exclusively self storage or do you do raises for other asset classes in, in our space?
Ryan (3m 5s): Yeah. So we, we built a mobile home park, one of the only mobile home parks that's been built in the state of Washington last year and sold that. And that's kinda a one off deal. And we've also raised money for RV parks. We have two RV parks in west Texas, and then we've done syndications for condo developments. But that's all of yesterday year. Right now we just raised for self storage and inevitably when we buy like big self storage portfolios, we might get a car wash that comes with one or we even have a chicken wing store that, that, that came with another one. But you know, for the most part that, you know, 95% of the portfolios are, are self storage.
And that's primarily what we're focused on.
Jesse (3m 41s): Just, just the, an an addendum to the, the crown jewels of a portfolio chicken wing store.
Ryan (3m 49s): Yeah, we're actually under contract to sell it. So we, we will no longer own kicking wings here at the end of the end of the year. So there you go. You
Jesse (3m 54s): Can, you can put that on the, on the cv.
Ryan (3m 57s): Exactly.
Jesse (3m 58s): In terms of the, so the self storage world, maybe for, for listeners, we've had a few guests that have talked about self storage. It's still kind of, you know, it, it's, it's almost for a lot of people that aren't as involved in it, it seems more like a kind of an operating business as opposed to a real estate, pure real estate play for those, you know, you're, you know, we mentioned before the show you're in front of an audience and you know, you pitch on self storage. You know what, what, what's your typical, you know, conversation on how you outline how you think about self storage?
Ryan (4m 32s): Yeah, so I always ask, you know, I, and I'm, you know, obviously when we pitch from, we're in front of high net worth investors, we're ahead of, you know, local Rios, everything in between, right? So I always ask the same question, which is, you know, how many people in the room have used a self storage and pretty much every hand goes up, it's pretty surprising, you know, or at least 90% of the room. And then the second question I say is, keep your hands up. If you used your self storage because you just simply have too much stuff and the hands go down, well, most of them go down, some of the, some of the people admit that they maybe needed to get rid of some things.
But my point in that is, is people use self storage, not because they have too much stuff, but because they have something that happens in their life that creates an event for self storage needs. And so I always give the personal story where I was just my wife and I in Seattle, we moved out of our apartment and bought a house and then we moved out of that smaller house and bought a larger house when we had our first kid. And we put our stuff in stuff in sell storage and we moved because we were in between selling a house and needing to stage it and prepare it for our, for, you know, to put our best foot forward to get it on the market.
And then, but we hadn't quite closed down our new house yet. And of course, you know, inevitably those things get delayed or there's things that take longer than you anticipate. And so you end up in sell stores for a little bit longer than, than you'd like. And then we moved into our larger house and wanted to renovate cuz we had a second child and then we had this thing called covid hit where we wanted to build an office in the house. We wanted to free up a room to work out in. We wanted to just kind of make better use out of the space that we have in our home. And so we kicked off a renovation and we ended up putting our stuff into self storage.
So it's amazing what life events do to drive the use of self storage. And I think people kind of look at the asset class, they kind of overlook it as like something that, well, you know, when times get bad, people will cut their, their memberships and cut their use of self storage and you know, I like multifamily or like another asset class because that's something that, that somebody's always going to be needing a place to live. But I think what people overlook is that self storage is a tool that people use during tumultuous times to rent when, when they have some kind of disruption and likewise when they have some good things happening, like an expanding family or a business that's booming, et cetera.
So I think it's, you know, it's, it's life events is probably what I would, what I would, you know, encourage people who are learning about the space to consider. And then the other thing is, you know, I always get the feedback that, you know, Ryan, they're just building them all over the place. You know, I see 'em going up on every single street corner and I feel like they're just building too many of them, but yet I go to them and they're full. And so I think what's interesting is from 2010 to 2020, they actually built more facilities, self storage facilities in the United States than they had in the previous asset class history of the, of the space.
But yet occupancies actually went up 10% on the average over time. So not only did they add all that inventory to the market, but it was absorbed and higher occupied at the end. And I think what Americans, especially c cell storage as is, is that tool to use in a, in a certain time of disruption. So it's an asset class that's here to stay and I think it's gonna perform really well as we head into a newer recession or, you know, a terrible time with interest rates getting jacked up. So.
Jesse (7m 57s): So on the, kind of, on the topic of individuals requiring self storage, it seems to be like with those stats, do you see any geographical stats or any trends in terms of urban versus rural in terms of the need for self storage or not? You know, when you're looking at portfolios or you're looking at purchasing sites, what does that look like?
Ryan (8m 19s): Yeah, I think life events are consistent, whether it be rural or urban. And I think that some of these more rural markets are building, you know, track developments of, of new subdivisions and homes that come with covenant restrictions that disallow you from putting that branded, you know, utility truck in your driveway after work or having tools or equipment in your driveway. And you know what's interesting, I think about self storage is 66% of Americans that run a self storage also have a garage.
So just because you have that bigger stable to put your stuff in doesn't necessarily mean that you don't have a need for for storage. And so an alternative to parking your truck or car, your work car in your driveways, a lot of people use self storage for auto, auto storing as well. And also like, and obviously in the urban areas it's the same thing. It's, you know, you have a, a rising cost per square foot for apartments and housing and so you look at self storage as maybe an alternative option to more efficiently storing belongings in, in cutting costs that way by having that into a self storage.
But also I think rural areas we see, you know, when you talk about rural, I mean how far out are you really talking? We like to be within 30 minutes of accessing a major population density center. So you know, 30 minutes south of Seattle or 30 minutes south of Atlanta, et cetera, where we can be, you know, where where there is a big population, maybe a bedroom community that lives in that area, but then drives into a city court to work.
Jesse (9m 51s): So you mentioned before the this idea of, you know, when people get self storage and the idea of actually, you know, saying, okay, I, I don't need it anymore. So the stickiness of, of self storage for the, you know, the technical term, what do you find when people are actually, you know, they, they have a life event, they have self storage. Like to me it's a lot to do with Parkinson's law. You know, when you, if you have enough space or if you have a a certain time, you end up using all of it somehow people fill the amount of storage. Like I just recently had, you know, storage at the front of my place.
I'm like, oh, this is now gonna be more than enough and two weeks later it's full. So, you know, how do, how does, how does that look from a, from a stickiness standpoint, it seems like when individuals do purchase or start or start leasing self storage that they stay, you know, for the long haul, if not add more to it.
Ryan (10m 43s): Yeah, it happens for a number of different reasons, but you're absolutely right. I don't think anybody intends to stay in there for just a few months. I think our average portfolio occupancy is 38 months right now. And so I think a lot of people move in with the intention of, oh, I'll just get it and need it, you know, temporarily. And then of course a year goes by or two years goes by and they think, well I've had it this long and what's, what's another couple of months? And when they, or when they go there, they open up the door and go, I don't wanna deal with this right now. So it's not like quitting a gym membership where well they make it difficult to quit a gym membership.
But, but, and there's other aspects at play, but I think it's the same thing in quitting your, having your unit I think is the sa is is the same, you know, and needs change and you know, things get swapped out. But you know, typically I like, I like what you said about Parkinson's law actually at work we've, at Spartan, we've actually started to take one hour meetings and turn them into half an hour meetings because Parkinson's law, if it's an hour meeting, you're gonna take the whole hour, right? So we've reduced that down to 30 minutes and I think people think the sa I think you're dead nuts on, I think it's the same thing in storage where you know, I have this, I have my storage unit so I can get more stuff and be a little bit more lackadaisical about getting rid of things or moving stuff around or what I really actually need because I have this space to use.
Jesse (11m 58s): So yeah, then for those interested just Google Parkinson's law and one, I actually, I can't remember which book, but recently the, the Law of Triviality and in just talking about how, you know, simple decisions like your example with work when you know, have a committee on, you know, picking the best lunch place for work, those things can take forever because everybody has opinion, but if something more technical people will, you know, you find that other people don't chime in as much. But anyways, two, two interesting little quirks.
How do you, how do you look at self storage as compared to our other asset classes, whether that's hotels, office, retail, industrial, where does it line up in terms of the kind of the benefits and maybe some of the cha challenges or drawbacks?
Ryan (12m 44s): Yeah, I would say I would, I would compare it most as far as what is it really like to operate a self storage business. I would compare it most to being like retail, when you're picking a location you have to think about retail. Like you have to think about in, in a retail mindset, you know how many people live around the three or five mile radius of a site because that is, that is, that's the market. You could be in Seattle, but it doesn't really matter where in it matters where you are in Seattle, not that you're in Seattle. And so people aren't gonna drive more than a few miles to rent your facility generally.
So you want to, you want to think about what are the characteristics of the population that immediately surround the property. And then the other thing, you know, comparing to other asset classes, I think that what makes us unique is that we actually have collateral on people's belongings. So if you don't pay, we actually can put a lien on what's inside of the units and auction off the, the storage contents if they don't pay after 30 days too. So we don't have the lean law or the eviction moratoriums or rent controls that a lot of the, as other asset classes do.
And I think what what makes it really powerful is the 30 day lease that we get. So, you know, they signed one, one lease agreement, it's good for into perpetuity but it's a 30 day lease meaning that we have control over the pricing of what we can charge that unit every 30 days. So when you think about inflation times where the CPI is going up, you know, seven to 9% and you're stuck in a triple net lease on some industrial tenant or some long term triple net lease, we're in a very good situation cuz we can increase our rents every 30 days to keep up with inflation.
And it's a very sticky business like you mentioned where once a tenant moves in, they're unlikely to move out. And with all the other facilities going up in cost and kind of keeping up with this trend, you can really increase that NOI advantageously for, for self storage. Some of the downsides, you know, obviously, and you know, when I think of the downsides I think of, you know, competition, people moving in, people building facilities around you, that's always gonna be be, you know, an a thing. So you just have to consider that when you're doing your feasibility study, you know, what building permits are in the pipeline and what demand and saturation numbers do I have and what is my competition charging.
You really have to do a good feasibility study to help mitigate some of that risk.
Jesse (15m 5s): So when you're looking at actually purchasing from the, the company standpoint or the acquisition standpoint, are you, what's the key metric for you? Are you breaking it down to a per square foot cost or is it more so a monthly income? How do you, how do you analyze that?
Ryan (15m 22s): Yeah, so I would say the first thing we look for are the ability to raise rents to market. So we'll look at what all the competitors are charging and we'll look at their occupancy and look, pull the data on that and see if there's an opportunity based on the current rent role, based on what people are paying currently to bring like kind valued properties to market rents. That's the, that's your lowest hanging fruit. The other thing that we like is we charge 10 insurance. So we can actually sell tenant insurance to our customers for in between 15 to $20 per month.
We're, we're retaining about 70% of that revenue. So we look at, you know, is the, is there an opportunity to add tenant insurance cause maybe the mom and pop that we're buying from didn't have tenant insurance to begin with. Then the next thing that we look at are the ability to expand the facility. So typically we like to go into a market that's underserved and we're buying a facility with excess land in which we can develop additional square footage on, thereby increasing the NOI and the overall value. And then the, you know, probably the last thing that we look at is just operational efficiencies that the mom and pop isn't taking advantage of currently.
Like good marketing, maybe they have a fully occupied facility, they haven't raised rents in a long time, they haven't done any fix up to the property, they haven't really made it look nice or they don't have a call center or they're not answering the phone or you know, just little quirky things that might be happening where it's like, man, I can't believe they're not doing that. That seems, seems obvious to, to, to implement that. So those are kind of the four things that we look at in any given opportunity.
Jesse (16m 53s): So not too dissimilar from other asset classes and buying, you know, where you can add density, you have potentially an operator that might be under utilizing some of the, what they're doing or not doing certain things that you would put in place. And seems like the systems are a big component of that. In terms of the, so on the other side of things where people investing with you, are you doing a funds model? Are you doing, you know, portfolio or asset specific raises for capital? What does that side of the business look like?
Cause the hat, one of the hats you wear is, is investor relations.
Ryan (17m 27s): Yeah, so we do both, we do deal by deal syndications and we do a fund. So we really have good options in as far as that goes. The other thing that we do is we don't, we not only raise equity, but we also have separate offerings where we can raise private debt and you can actually invest in notes, promissory notes with a personal guarantee on the debt side, you know, we have short term debt needs across the portfolio to buy existing facilities that are already well occupied and cash flowing to, you know, needing to add on additional units and just kind of bolting on that private debt in the back.
But we, we do both and, but, but most recently we had a fund that targeted very specific types of value add self storages, but that's winding down. And in the new year we'll have a new offering that is a single asset syndication. So it's, you know, it's a one offering with limited properties, but it's a large portfolio of about 30 properties. So our offerings, while they're, while they're not funds pretty much in self storage, you know, when they, you know, typically it's rare to find a one deal one, one facility syndication just because the dollar amounts on these facilities are so small or like a multifamily, you know, it's easy to find a 20 or 30 million building.
It's, it's less common in storage and more common to find more of a portfolio purchase.
Jesse (18m 47s): And I guess from that point of view, if it is a fun model or multiple properties, you know, to, to avoid drag on your capital, it looks like you have to have, you know, some, a good pipeline of deals coming in. What does that process look for you in terms of actually sourcing, finding acquisitions?
Ryan (19m 3s): Yeah, we buy a facility about every other week on the average and we have a team of about five people on our acquisitions team. And we're looking at both off market and on market opportunities with listed with brokers. And so we've got deep relationships with our sellers, deep relationships with our brokers and just your standard, do what you say you're gonna do attitude about, you know, sticking to contracts and closing everything that we've purchased is really important to get, you know, quality deal flow for our investors.
Jesse (19m 31s): Yeah, no, not not getting bogged down in re trades and, and filling
Ryan (19m 35s): Around. Well it's interesting time right now. Interest rates going up, that's for sure.
Jesse (19m 40s): For sure. And, and on that note, I'd like to talk a little bit about the, so we've talked a little in terms of the inflation head hedge. I think in general, you know, I think listeners know real estate, part of the reason we do, you know, you have that other piece of the puzzle when you have the state of the economy where it's at right now, inflation going up, you know, at the very least you can download that to your renters in this case download to your customers with probably more flexibility, flexibility given the short-term nature of your contracts.
In terms of the interest rate environment, I'm not gonna ask you to crystal ball things here, but how are you preparing, how's the company preparing for, you know, the next year, you know, what steps have you taken, if any, and, and has, has that affected your investment philosophy?
Ryan (20m 28s): Yeah, so I, I think this started five years ago when we started buying self storage. We only took on fixed rate debt and for the most part long term fixed rate debt. And we didn't have the, we don't have a need to buy interest rate caps or a need to be in a, in a, a panic with expiring loans right now. I think our next, I think our first expiry of an interest rate and you know, we've been buying storage since 2017 is in 2026. So, and that was one of our early on that was like one of our first sell storage loans that we've ever taken on.
So, you know, fixed rate debt is really important and I think we're seeing that in the market right now where some of these multifamily bridge loans maybe becoming, coming to the end of their, of their term and they need to be refinanced into higher interest rate debt and maybe the rents haven't gone up or the business plan can't support that higher interest rate. So we're not subject to that. We do have one portfolio in our entire ecosystem that has a variable rate and that was only because it was recently negotiated and you know, unfortunately, you know, we had no other option, but that also was done at a very low, you know, sofa index.
So not, not terrible, you know, four and a half, 5% effective rate even with today's interest rates, which is, which is not as good as we thought it was gonna be, but, but definitely not great. So I think going forward, you know, I'd encourage, you know, you know, others that are looking at buying or looking at investing, you know, make sure that you're investing in fixed rate debt, obviously that's really important to, you know, to strategize against and you know, we're seeing obviously rising interest rate environments. We're also seeing, you know, a bigger spread on prime or on sofa that would even further drive up the interest rates.
You know, the banks just don't want to take the, the risk of fixed rate debt and getting into, into a high interest rate environment where they've locked you in really low. So
Jesse (22m 23s): Yeah, and, and for future acquisitions, you know, as where we're at right now in terms of the underwriting, I imagine it's just going to be something where there's a little bit more of a conservative nature going forward. I, I had a discussion with one of my colleagues and we're talking about the trade off between your, you know, return on equity, you know, when you're putting more down, obviously there, the cash flow is going to be better, your return on equity is going to be lower, but you know, from my standpoint, especially living in a very expensive market for us, you know, if you've ever experienced negative cash flow or, or you've ever lived in an area where people will buy negative cash flow because the appreciation has been a hockey stick graph, once you start getting burnt on that, you start realizing that, you know, what, 14% IRR doesn't sound so bad when, when the world isn't, when the world's blowing up.
So what's your view on that when you go forward in terms of, you know, cash flow, the amount of equity you raise and just, just, you know, conservative underwriting in general?
Ryan (23m 26s): Yeah, I would say that going forward, I think it's, you, you are going to have to put more down or you're gonna have to find a seller finance transaction if the seller wants top dollar or you'll see a decrease in the amount of deals that you can actually make work if they don't have enough value to add add. You know, we set out this year to buy 400 million and we've only purchased about a hundred million and that's because we got into an environment where the interest rate was so high and the cap rate was so low and cap rates have not really changed all that much in our, in our industry.
You know, you look at the last Green Street report that came out, you know, the end of October, cap rates have only gone up in self storage 20 basis points since all this started, but yet interest rates are up, what 350 basis points from the start of the year. And so the, the pricing has not adjusted to what the Fed funds rate is, and that's, that's slowing down acquisitions or it's creating a need for some kind of seller financing. But, but also I gotta throw out there that there's a lot of equity still in the market. There's a lot of wealth that's been created over the last decade in sell storage or in just in the industry in general where there's groups out there still paying cash.
So there's still a, a a, you know, a stockade, there's still a bunch of buyers out there that are transacting. We're selling two properties at the end of this year, like I mentioned earlier, for full price. I mean we're, we're getting every dollar we, we, we would've gotten that price a year ago. We're getting it today. We're, we're really not seeing any discounts yet in the market. And I think, I don't, I don't know if we're ever really gonna get to that point. So if you're a buyer that relies on financing to transact from traditional banks, you know, you might just see your margins go down a little bit or again, like you said over equitize or get creative with seller backed financing.
Jesse (25m 13s): Yeah, and I think there's, there's also a limit to, you know, seller financing. Even if you can do it at a certain point, it's, you know, your debt service coverage is still still impacted if, you know, unless you have somebody giving you free money. But I think, yeah, I think, I think we're seeing that across the board right now. It's funny what you said for, for Green Street report, like it comes down from, from our point of view is that the bid ask spread, it's just we haven't, we don't have buy we don't have sellers yet. Not across the board acknowledging that their prices need to come down or they just, you know, whether it's taking off the market weighted out.
But I think we're, in our, especially in our more expensive markets, I think we're gonna start seeing them fatigue a little and it's gonna be the ones that didn't do what Spartan has, has done it seems, and have that variable debt or that, you know, that refinancing coming up and that'll probably trigger a little bit more slack in the, in the, in the market in terms of actually getting some stuff at a bit more of a discount. Where do you see the opportunities for, for your team 20 23, 20 24? Whether that's asset specific or geographically?
Ryan (26m 23s): Yeah, I would say, you know, sticking to fundamentals of what, where we buy the Sunbelt high growth states, what makes self storage really attractive I think is the fact that it doesn't matter if it's a blue state or red state. You know, our rental landlord laws are nonexistent pretty much. I mean we, we all have the state law that we have to comply with for lean, lean auctions and lean rule laws, but they're pretty consistent nationwide. So we really like that. So we're gonna continue to go in places like the Pacific Northwest, Texas, Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, where population is going.
I think those fundamentals aren't gonna change at all in that, in that regard. I think opportunities are gonna be in development. I think opportunities are gonna be in, you know, deep value add. I think that's gonna be a a, a play. I think buying what we've, what we've typically purchased for at a discount based on the current financing in today's market is still an opportunity. As much as I say prices haven't changed, sometimes they do sometimes, like you said, you stumble on that, that transaction and we bought a portfolio this year and we re traded two and a half million off the price because of interest rates and you know, maybe today, yeah, the cash flows okay, you know, maybe mid single digits, but in a year or two from now and rates adjust and go back down, you know, our NOI is increasing and we're gonna be able to pull out, you know, you know, potentially a lower interest rate loan with great proceeds essent, you know, at some point in the future.
So I think, I think investors wanna think short term sometimes, but really long term, I think there's a really great opportunity to be in commercial real estate in general, specifically self storage based on what was purchased today at maybe a little bit less of a, of a premium than what would've otherwise transacted because of the temporary environment of interest rates.
Jesse (28m 13s): Yeah, it's kind of rare too. You have this asset class that's pretty apolitical. I think that part of the reason, at least in kind of the Canadian sphere, we're seeing more self storage is the fact that most areas, we have such strict laws when it comes to rent control that, you know, investors are like, well, this makes more sense. We can, we can actually raise rent, you know, when a contract ends. Which is not a crazy idea, but it's definitely something I think we're seeing, we're definitely seeing more of up here, you know, it's, it's exploded over the last five years in the states, but no, those are, those are great points.
Ryan (28m 49s): Yeah, and I, I think, you know, that's, I always like to say, you know, we got into this, one of the reasons why we got into this space is because we never wanted to be in the business of kicking somebody outta their house. You know, that, and, and you know, when we go into c and other, you know, economic downturns, the government doesn't wanna see that either, which is why they put all these restrictions in place. But I always joke that nobody really cares about grandma's dresser, you know, so no problem, no, no problem kicking somebody outta their unit, but, you know, again, their home is a, is a much more serious matter. So I don't, I don't think you're gonna see that go away anytime soon, so let's hope not.
Jesse (29m 23s): Yeah, yeah. Well it's funny, even like during the, during the pandemic here, I remember having buddies working out at some of their self storage cuz they were big enough and we just had such strict shutdowns. But no, that's funny. I wanna be mindful of your time here, Ryan. I basically, in terms of kind of going forward, maybe before we, you know, we'll ask for where people can reach out to you, but in terms of kind of investing or learning more, where, where would you direct listeners to, and we'll put some show notes and links up as well.
Ryan (29m 55s): Yeah, we put out a really nice self storage blog and just state of the economy. We actually put a new article up every week in our, on our website, spartan hyphen investors.com. It's S P A R T A N hyphen investors.com. And there's a newsroom that we have that we put out articles in. So if you're just interested in doing that, you can subscribe to our newsletter too. We do a print and digital version of our newsletter, which is kind of fun and, but my email address is ryan spartan hyphen investors.com.
You can catch me on all the social media channels too. So
Jesse (30m 31s): My guess today has been Ryan Gibson. Ryan, thanks for being part of Working Capital.
Ryan (30m 35s): Thank you.
Jesse (30m 49s): Thank you so much for listening to Working Capital, the Real Estate podcast. I'm your host, Jesse Fraga. If you like the episode, head on to iTunes and leave us a five star review and share on social media. It really helps us out. If you have any questions, feel free to reach out to me on Instagram. Jesse Fali, F R A G A L E. Have a good one. Take care.