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Jul 21, 2021

Chris Prefontaine is a three times Best Selling Author of Real Estate on Your Terms, The New Rules of Real Estate Investing, and Moneeka Sawyer’s Real Estate Investing for Women. He’s also the Founder and CEO of SmartRealEstateCoach.com and host of the Smart Real Estate Coach Podcast.

In this episode we talked about:

  • How Chris got into Real Estate
  • The “On Terms” investment strategy
  • Non-bank financing
  • Owner financing
  • Principal only payments
  • Family run businesses
  • Importance of value and mission statements
  • The value of discipline
  • The power of self accountability
  • The impact of Great Recession on Real Estate profitability
  • Searching for Deals
  • Distribution of Team Roles
  • Opportunities in 2021
  • Mentorship, Resources and Lessons Learned

Useful links:
https://smartrealestatecoach.com

Transcription:

Jesse (0s): Welcome to the working capital real estate podcast. My name is Jesper galley. And on this show, we discuss all things real estate with investors and experts in a variety of industries that impact real estate. Whether you're looking at your first investment or raising your first fund, join me and let's build that portfolio one square foot at a time. All right, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to working capital the real estate podcast. My name is Jesse Fragale and my special guest today is Chris Prefontaine. Chris is a three-time bestselling author of real estate on your terms, the new rules of real estate investing and when Nika Sawyer is real estate investing for women, he's also the founder and CEO of smart real estate coach.com and the host of smart real estate coach podcast. 

 

Chris, how's it going? 

 

Chris (47s): I am doing awesome. Thanks Jesse. Thanks for having me on. 

 

Jesse (50s): Yeah, my pleasure. Like I was saying before the show, we're very happy to have you on, I did get a copy of your book. I believe the one I received was new rules of real estate investing. I brought that into, into the brokerage into the office. So a lot of good stuff in there. I found it really interesting just because it took a little bit of a different approach as it was kind of a best or greatest hits of different people and different experts giving their view. So hopefully we can get into that. How's everything been. I mean, we're in a bit of a unique world right now. 

 

How have you, how have you been fairing over the last, the last year or so? 

 

Chris (1m 27s): Yeah, we're super busy. I hate to, I hesitate all the time to say that, cause I know some people get hurt, but literally from April 1st, 2020, we have crank and it got a little tight with the market being so crazy these last few months, but we're literally, as of this morning, seeing the people commenting and the deals going up through the roof again all across north America. So that's kinda neat. We built this to kind of hit all markets and it's doing well with it, you know, it's been tested. 

 

Jesse (1m 54s): Yeah, for sure. So for listeners, a little bit of a background, your experience ranges back into the nineties for those, you know, that it's the first time hearing your name, hearing you speak. Maybe you could talk a little bit about your history and how you got into real estate. Obviously, you know, you've seen more cycles than a, well, I'd say a few of the guests that we have on more than I wanted to probably yeah. So high 

 

Chris (2m 20s): Level, right? Cause it would be 30 years. It'd be here too long, but I, I journeyed into real estate doing some building. I never was a builder, had a partner who ran the field. I ran inside. We did everything on terms back then without knowing it without calling it terms, I was in my twenties. So we, we found lots. We pre-market them. We sold a finished package and everybody could pay it a day and it was pretty cool. I then bought a Realty executives, franchise, mid nineties, sold that to Coldwell banker, ultimately in 2000. And then I started coaching people throughout U S and Canada, heavy Canada at the time, coincidentally up in Toronto, but 48 clients or so up there that while that was going on, I started doing some of my own investments from 2000 up to the crash. 

 

And then that brought us to today in the sense that the crash has beat us up. I mean that I was on personally on signature in the U S on loans, 23 properties or so. So in the values drop where they come in, they're coming to me, unfortunately. So that caused us though, Jesse to rewrite the rules. So to speak, not to use the book, no pun intended there, but causes us to recreate what we're doing. Re-engineer what we're doing. And that is now we buy everything on a terms. We do not use banks. We don't sign personally. We very rarely if ever used that capital and that way I can go to sleep at night, knowing that we're not at risk, if we were a pre crash, you know? 

 

So we've gone through all those storms that you alluded to and rebuild this model to only buy on terms. 

 

Jesse (3m 43s): So before we get into that, the clear follow up question is would, is on terms. But before we do in the nineties and subsequent to that, w w was the wheelhouse for you in real estate? What, was there something that, that, you know, gave you the bug of, of wanting to get into real estate, as opposed to, you know, other areas, 

 

Chris (4m 4s): You know, the bug so to speak was when I was younger, my dad was not in real estate. He would, he had a welding business, but he had branches. And as he would expand, he personally would build the building and lease it back to the business. And I was young and I go, whoa, you're the same person. How does it, like, how do you do that? So that's where I started to learn real estate. And it was kind of cool. He always said that up until a few years ago. So then he would find land tracks of land engineer, do the engineering and flip them. So he just always tinkered. And I had, I really was around that environment a lot. And then, so as soon as he sold the company back in 91, I think he sold his company where I was working. 

 

I went into real estate. That's when I started building 

 

Jesse (4m 41s): Right on. Awesome. So let's move on to that for, for listeners. W w you know, you hear in the industry, I mean, not so long ago, the first time I heard that on terms, you know, you alluded to a little bit about getting non-conventional financing. Why don't you give listeners just kind of an understanding of what that means? 

 

Chris (5m 1s): Yeah. So for us terms means a better word that people would recognize as creative real estate, right? So terms for us means three things. We buy, lease, purchase, owner financing, or subject to existing financing, lease purchase being, in my opinion, the simplest entry, if you're new, we're looking to expand what you're doing, because you're not taking title. Your risk is definitely minimal. You are in our agreements. Anyway, you are putting up $10 for at least prejudice. All our properties. 

 

We could show about 80 million with our students in our own, and there's not more than a few thousand spent total on all the 80 million control, because a lot of us that own these purchase on a freelancing niche is a little bit different niche. We drill down deeper than just regular on a pricing. We look Jessie for a free and clear properties. So owners that are free and clear, they're in a good spot. Most of them not even in the market and they want longer term, they want the, the, the, the estate planning or the tax planning to be longer term my building. I'm not in it today, but my building right, five minutes from my house was bought from an investor who had this building for 120 years, 18 years, it was free and clear. 

 

And he sold to me on owner financing. You know, I don't care where you are. If you go for a mixed use building loan right now, it's grueling underwriting. I didn't do any of that. It was a handshake quick PNS closing in 30 days done. So just, 

 

Jesse (6m 23s): Just to recap there, lease purchase owner financing, and what was the third one subject 

 

Chris (6m 28s): To existing finance. So sub two for slang, sub two. So that means I buy your house for those listening and you owe some money on it, but I'm buying it. And the loan is staying in your name, even though deeds transferring. And so, again, I own the house. I don't have a lease purchase on it. I own it. And I'd appreciate it. And I get all the owner benefits, but the loan stays in your name until someday I cash it out. 

 

Jesse (6m 49s): Interesting. I, you know, I've, I've heard, I've heard this recently called something different, but that, so in the, in, so it's not, it's outright ownership. It's not a lien on the house. It's you actually owning and being like you said, being able to depreciate. 

 

Chris (7m 2s): Yeah, no, definitely own it. It, you know, disclosure do, do people who have a ton of equity typically, are they okay with entering into that with their name and alone? No. Do do sellers who don't know you that well, gladly jump into that environment. No, not all of them. Now, many of them will enter a lease purchase. We'll build up the trust will build up the credibility and we'll transfer that to a sub to later that happens a lot or someone needs immediate debt relief, and frankly, they don't care. 

 

They want it done. They'll do sub two. 

 

Jesse (7m 35s): Yeah. I could see that. I mean, the logical movement from owner financing where, you know, sometimes you have two, three year debt and then having a track record and building up, and then being able to push the relationship further, the lease purchase th this, this piece here is this, would this be similar to an assignment or a wholesale or, or is this something different? 

 

Chris (7m 57s): Good question. So the way at least purchase works and you can circle back and say, yup, bingo or no, I didn't hit it. So all these purchases like this, let's say your house, we agree it's worth about 300 grand. You owe about two 50. My lease purchase says, I'm going to start making your underlying debt payment on your behalf, but everything stayed in your name. Once I find my buyer, we put tenant buyers in these homes rent down. So once I find my buyer, I got, and I stopped making payments on your property with the promise that on or before the end of the term, I'm going to pay off your loan, which is less. 

 

Now that's my benefit. And I'm going to give you a 50 grand equity that we agreed. You had some projecting that as long as you can wait for it. So what's the difference between that and maybe an assignment or a wholesale. We get paid three ways on all our deals. So we trade rocked out in the United States. So we get, we get payments upfront. We get payments over time. We get payments when we sell versus one payday. So, which I did for years, it's lucrative. But I don't know if that answered your question. Yeah. 

 

Jesse (8m 52s): I think it did. In terms of, you know, you hear so many different terms in real estate and really trying to drill down on what exactly it is. And that could go from, you know, everything changes from country to country, state, to state province, the province. And, you know, there might be just a wrinkle. That's a little bit different. You mentioned patented or certain trademarks. How did you go about that process? Having that trademark? Are you talking about the, just the term itself? 

 

Chris (9m 15s): Yeah. Three paydays. So we created that after we re-engineer things after the crash to get paid three times, I just started saying, wait a minute. It's like, I'm on a treadmill. Real estate treated me really good, but it's like, you're on a treadmill. Every January, you start over, right. If you're doing building or wholesaling or you're real tight, did that for years. So this way we get paid three times and yeah, we had attorneys file in the United States, took awhile for three pay days. We have all the things like our logo and things that in the company, but three paydays was an important one because no, one's had it. 

 

Jesse (9m 43s): Yeah. It's almost like you want that recurring revenue in the real estate version of that. Yep, absolutely. So for, for yourself, Chris, when, at what point did you make the move or maybe it was at the beginning, but if not, what point did you make the move from going into real estate? Full-time that, that this was your full-time gig? 

 

Chris (10m 3s): I started tinkering with it around, well, I've always tinkered with it, but late eighties, I started tinkering with it on the side, so to speak like a lot of people do. And then when my father sold his company, 91, the company lasted as a corporate structure. I was used to entrepreneurial mindset. I lasted about maybe three weeks before they fired me. And my kids were probably a two and three at the time. So that, that, you know, you get a severance practice for four weeks and then you're out. So I had to kind of move fast. Luckily I had a couple deals going and then we just ramped it up right 

 

Jesse (10m 34s): On. So for, for the comparison, you know, we talk a lot on this show about real estate, flipping wholesaling, apartment buildings, commercial real estate is the space that I live in. You know, what's, what's the difference, you know, what's the value add here, or what's the, the value proposition or difference with this type of investing? 

 

Chris (10m 54s): Well, first I'll say, cause I have, I have all of those niches that you just said on my podcast, good friends. So I'm not, I'm not against any niche. They're all wonderful. And they're meant for some, all the lessons are going to attach to what they want, in my opinion, why I gravitate towards this and stay with this after all the things I've done is the, the minimal risk. I'll never say none, but the minimal risk because I'm not going on any loans. That's the Milan number two from going to get paid. Why not create three pays per one deal? It's real simple. So if I do a deal today and it's, even if it's a hundred thousand all day, I'm just using that number. 

 

It's over. If it's a build or flip or wholesale, if I do a deal today, and it's three pay days, I've got somewhere around 75 is our average, but 75 to 250 grand paying me over the next three years, next deal next three or four years or five years or 10 years. So you have this spreadsheet. Eventually we have all this income coming in. You can take six months off if you want predictably, and you can see where to, once you track all this. So the three payday and the low risk is the, is the main reason. The third is it was built. Jesse, if you remember my steroid coming out of the crash, it was built not just to kind of weather the storms and then COVID slapped us. 

 

And then we went, okay. Work, not only at work, but we thrive. So it's a great tool for up down and flat markets really is. So 

 

Jesse (12m 7s): What was it about the, the crash or the great recession that, that really amplified or put a spotlight on how lucrative or beneficial this type of investing can be? 

 

Chris (12m 20s): It wasn't, it was from a defense mode. I wish I could tell you that I brilliantly thought of this thing was going to be great after, but I didn't. I, what I said was all right, I just had four years, it took from oh eight til 12. I had four years of just garbage, you know, loans being called for colleges workouts the whole bit. That was, that was stressful. So it was more, what can I do that? Doesn't go that way ever again. It wasn't, oh, I got this brilliant light bulb then organically. It evolved to the three paydays and to building what we, what we built today to be doing deals all over the country. 

 

Jesse (12m 52s): So Chris, when, when you put these deals together, if from a high level, what type of structure do you typically use? You've talked a little bit about that. You know, you have different people on your podcast, you hear corporate structure, LLCs partnerships. W what would you use for this? 

 

Chris (13m 9s): Ah, good question. So in the lease purchase is pretty simple, Jesse, because you're not taking title, nothing's even going to show up on record. So we just had that and we started in an LLC. It's your comfort level? It's like my attorneys to say, when the basket tips over, are you comfortable with what's in it? Right? So we would do a 10 or 12 deals in one LLC on the sub two deals. It gets a little bit more, I won't say complex. It gets a little more detailed. We take it in a land trust. A company is the beneficiary. So it's a little bit more anonymous and on the, on a Francine deal, same thing, LLC. 

 

Jesse (13m 43s): Got it. One of the biggest things that we hear, and I'm sure you've heard it on your podcast, especially at this point in the market, even with, with the, you know, the last 18 months is just the ability to find deals or inability to find deals. How do you approach that? What's the, what's the method for yourself when you're looking at it through the context of terms. 

 

Chris (14m 5s): I agree with you, first of all, wholeheartedly it's we are talking to more sellers to get a deal. Now there's no question about it. So I always tell my students, like literally today, we're talking about this, a fish in a different pond. So I love fishing in the pond of these free and clear properties, for example, because usually they're not dying to sell that are harder to sell. They don't want to pay a relative they're free and clear. They just have, I'll call it an ego. It's a healthy one, but it's usually I want this price. I don't care what's going on. We don't care about price if I, if we get the term. 

 

So they love that because you're satisfying their price issue. So that's one point deficient. The second one is unfortunately now, just so you know, this, there's a lot of people that need help right now. They're kind of like below the radar, they got beat up a little bit with COVID or they had these forbearance agreements that are now coming an end or stressing about. So we're finding a lot of those finding us where we've, where we've set up our name properly in these markets. Those are two great areas to fishing because they want you, they, they want a guy and they want different, do I fight for MLS properties or properties that are, or else is going to have to know? 

 

It's just to your point, too competitive right now. 

 

Jesse (15m 10s): Yeah. And what I found, you know, when you described this type of investing and even in your book, what I think just comes to mind, right. Or right or wrong is I always think of more push marketing or sorry, pull marketing rather than push marketing. I feel like you put, you go out there and you put yourself, you put your name out there and have people come to you at a certain point, but it is first of all, is that, is that the case for what you do and has that evolved since you, since you started, 

 

Chris (15m 39s): That's a great observation. So what happens is typically for us is we'll start a new student. I just had two brand new ones on today, and I'll have them doing what you just referred to as push, because they've got to start cultivating something. And as they rise in the ranks, I'll say for lack of a better expression, we teach them how to become what we call the authority so that yes, now you get more of a pull. You're establishing yourself more and more. You're layering in all this authority stuff, whether it's a book or a podcast or a blog or whatever it might be. So you are the local expert. So when these national companies come in, they're in every market we're in by the I buyers, are we calling all these other companies? 

 

They don't really affect us because we're the local expert once we've got established. So the answer is, it's both it just transitions to more pull a little bit later on in the career. And it usually takes a good couple of years. 

 

Jesse (16m 27s): And from a, a, you draw out a well-oiled machine now, just from a, a cost perspective, you know, does the marketing take up a large, you know, percentage of, of what you do in terms of costs? You know, after a while, I think people that are in your space seem to seem to have a knack for what they're doing. Do you guys put a lot of resources and effort into the marketing? 

 

Chris (16m 49s): We don't mailing wise. I know like the wholesalers that I know, oh gosh. How was that? How was that a group of private group wants, and someone was spending 10, 20, 30 grand a month. Yeah. We spend to do ideals that they create three paydays. And that average us a low of 45,000, a high of two 50 per deal. All three we're spending overhead wise about a grand a month. Our students were spending more now. So what's the ramp up the ramp up would be more, I'd rather put a VA on a virtual assistant, calling more houses than I would put mailing pieces of the door only because I know, I know the metrics now, you know, he was doing terms 30 years in the biz. 

 

I know the metrics. And then a little bit more predictable, in my opinion, in number two, I don't want a new student. It's a bummer. When you have to say to a new student, Hey, you know, you have a budget of five or 10 grand a month. So we don't do heavy marketing. Believe it or not. If we do it's in the hundreds per month, not thousands of tens of thousands. 

 

Jesse (17m 41s): Have you found that this type of approach has, has had a, a state or two that it's something that really works and is, is really conducive to in other states not so much. And what's, if so, w what, what are those? 

 

Chris (17m 60s): Okay. And this is a good question. You're hitting some good high points that I usually don't get. So this is awesome. It's usually not the state. It's usually, I don't care if we're in a flat or down or up market. It's usually going a little bit on the outskirts of, of kind of like, let's say, New York city, would you be doing a lot of terms deals right in the city? I'd rather you go out a little bit, cause you're gonna have a little, it's gonna be a little hectic. I want to go into the outskirts. I want to go where even in a hot market, you have some expired listings in the MLS that, you know, I want to go out a little bit to get out of the frenzy. That's all. 

 

Jesse (18m 31s): Okay. And w w what's the, what's the rationale there? It's just that there's, there's more volume. There's, there's more of what you're looking for there. As, in terms of a, 

 

Chris (18m 40s): You need our guidance more, you know, right now everything's selling so quickly. So like you said, we got a fish in different ponds, but one of those ways to fish differently is just go out a little bit from the frenzy. Now, keep in mind. Remember I said, one of my favorites is free and clear. Yeah. Well, a third of the property in the United States, roughly a third are free and cliff really that's all the, all the country. So how about, how about just talk to the free and clear people. They want to talk to you. They're awesome to deal with. They don't need money, quote unquote. And they would've pulled it out already. Right? So the fun to deal with, 

 

Jesse (19m 9s): That's fascinating. Three out of four, three to four properties that are owned in the states are free and clear. 

 

Chris (19m 16s): One, one third, one third are free and clear. Third. Yeah. 

 

Jesse (19m 20s): Yeah. You haven't even 33%. That's pretty, that's pretty amazing. Now for, for your process to find these, whether the, you know, is it secretary of state, is it a land registry? Where do you go to find the properties that you know, are, have a mortgage paid off? 

 

Chris (19m 35s): We have two different softwares we use that are free in our resource center, but the one that does the free and clear very well is prop stream. Let me do a great job. And then freedom soft is, is where we pull a lot of, out of the less. It's crazy. Now you can, you know, I can only set to the sky today to show. You said, you could find out, you can go geographically and go. I want everybody in this zip code that has a mortgage of this much percentage. And you know, where's pink socks. I mean, you can buy any data now. It's crazy. 

 

Jesse (20m 3s): All right, one sec, let me make a note of pink socks here. You know, what it is, it is pretty amazing how the, I think it's a good thing. A lot of this information has been democratized, just my, you know, myself being a broker. I've never been of the mind that having this stuff unavailable to the public was, or having it just available to us with some sort of, you know, competitive advantage. I feel like if people want to get information and, and can use it properly, I mean, if it really came down to access, we would all be millionaires and ripped because, you know, w where was Google 30 years ago. 

 

So take us to the book. I, I, like I said, in the beginning, it's, it's a very interesting book in the sense that it's, it's kind of a amalgamation of different viewpoints experts. And for those that, that want a link, we can definitely put one in the show notes, but yeah, take us back to this process. Every person I've talked to that has, has written a book. I know it's a long and challenging process. How did that go for you? 

 

Chris (21m 1s): Okay. So here, here's how it went. And here's why, so the first book we did, and then we we've since revised it, and it's a bestseller it's called real estate on your terms. And it was very us like very niche. How do you do what we just talked about? You and I, and so some people on my show said, well, that's great, but you seem bias. I said, I'm biased because that's what I do now, but I'm not so naive to think everybody has to do that. So then we said, all right, so let's take all the podcasts interviews that we have a majority of at the time, and let's take the 24 or so that we love the most that we think that can be the most broad. 

 

And let's have everybody do a chapter. And so that people could look at us and say, it's free info. We're going to go look at the 24 different experts in this book, we did the new rules of real estate. And then we get to pick where we want to go. And if it's termed great, if it's tax liens, great, whatever you want to do, I just want it to be more out there of prosperity mindset versus no, this is the only way you do it, even though clearly I believe that because I'm in it, but that, that everybody has their fit, right. Here's a quick formula. I say, when you read the book, do this say, okay, what niche can I get behind? 

 

Like what, what do I get rubbed about too? Can I find someone in that niche that already did what I want to do with success? Leaves, clues. There's no reason for you to reinvent it, right? I didn't create terms. It was available in the 18 hundreds. And then third then put blinders on for 36 months. If you do that, you'll have a great experience at any niche. So I wanted to expose them all. If that makes sense. Long answer to a good question. 

 

Jesse (22m 25s): No, it does make sense in terms of how you want about picking your, your list there. What was it, what was that process 

 

Chris (22m 32s): Like? I wanted similar to my show recently, I'm really picky with this. Now. I wanted people that have been through market cycles and, or life events, both a great, so example for me, my son had a head injury and no three doctors told my wife and I had never walked talk or eat again. He's running the business with me then nine 11, and then COVID, and then the different market. Okay. So this some crap thing, right. That people can learn from while same in this book. If you look in there that one of the, the guy that does tax lanes, I think he's like 82 years old and still doing it. 

 

Well, you can learn a crap load from him. Like I just wanted to experience versus brand brand new. And it's not that, that bad. My son's been, my son-in-law has been at this for seven years. He knew do hundreds of deals now, but, you know, he learned from some great mentors, but, but by and large, I wanted a lot of experience. That's all. Yeah. 

 

Jesse (23m 18s): I, I live really like that format. I think it's, hopefully I don't butcher this, but I think it's the Titans of real estate. A book I read recently that was similar in layout. You know, it was real estate, but you would have on one side of developer, another side, a investor in industrial and other side office. So it was really good to get every perspective. And like you said, it's, I mean, it's not gonna appeal to everybody. You're gonna be biased in certain ways. There were some chapters where halfway through, I'm like, yeah, you know what? Good, nice to know. Not really, not really my cup of tea. You talk a little bit, or you, you talked a little bit about your son there. 

 

One thing I thought was really cool, just like when we got Jake and Gino on a very family-oriented, I'm the same way your team, you picked some of, some of the people closest to you. Maybe you could talk a little bit about the team that you have in what you're doing and how that's, how that's impacted you and, and just day-to-day life. Yeah. And by the 

 

Chris (24m 9s): Way, I hung out with them too. I think I was on their show on vice versa, that fun Jacobs, you know, they're good guys. You know what? It's somewhat of the answer I gave you that when I said I didn't brainchild that the niche and kind of organically happen, what happened to this business? And the family was, Nick has always been around me. He witnessed a lot of the stuff I went through in oh eight. We literally share an office. That's my son. So when I get busy and 14 ish, I think it was, he started as a broker at the same office as me. I'd go, Hey, I can help you on the buyer side, I get it. I not do this online. And they said, great. We started slow. 

 

He then went full time. And then my son-in-law and my daughter, Kayla were in the bartending and personal training business in this area. That's big, it's a tourist area. And money was good lifestyle crappy. So they said in 15, is there any room for us to come in? I said, you have game for like incentive. We do deals. We make, we don't, we don't, you don't get paid if you're good for that. So they came in, everyone kind of organically took what they like, Nick does buyers still, Zach loves doing what I didn't duplicate me. Kayla ran the office. She's busy with the kids now, but the point is, they all organically, when it wasn't like I had this massive plan kid said, Hey, let's hand fuck these people. 

 

Right. So it's good. That way it's helped because everyone does what they really like to do in their own zone. That's how it started. And now I've got a team of like 12 or 14 people. 

 

Jesse (25m 23s): Yeah, that's great. What are you? You know, what are the opportunities at this point? And we're in 2021 or halfway through the year, it's been a tumultuous 12 to 18 months for a lot of people. But I think every person that's been on this show has talked about opportunities. We're where are you setting your sights on right now? 

 

Chris (25m 42s): Hey, this is what I've been screaming about. And to this day, I think tomorrow night, I'm talking about it with a group. And that is, I think, as the market slowly starts to turn again. And who knows when, if you and I knew we wouldn't run the show together, it would be on a beach somewhere. But when it does, I think in the next nine to 12 months, anyone in the terms, niche or Marietta reasons for another show, and it's the opportunity to get probably a decade worth of income. And the reason I'm saying that is this. I look back to like 13 or 14. 

 

Some of those deals are now cashing out, literally like this month. And I can equate all of the next six weeks, probably half a million to a million more in cash outs for our personal team, not the students all coming from a few years ago. Well, the, the market right now is screaming for deals outside of the conventional bank. My opinion, the amount of deals being done in the us outside of banks used to be like one or 2% in the nineties. It's I don't know the percent now, Jesse, but it's big. It's like in the teens, that's a lot of deals and need the guidance and they, they there's tied a lot of the bank crap going on. 

 

And so I think there's a big opportunity that in our niche, that's why I'm putting full gas pedal down, starting April 20. We just not doubling down versus pulling back. 

 

Jesse (26m 56s): Yeah, I wish there was, there was more re like there are tons of resources out there for real estate, but ones that you can trust because, you know, we're in this space I've been investing for, for quite a number of years. You have been, I have the benefit of being in brokerage. So a lot of these contracts and these things that you do outside of the normal normal realm of financing, or you know, who you're dealing with in real estate, or just something that we're surrounded by. And I think people, you know, that say the PR the private or exempt market for instance, is just one example. 

 

I think people generally speaking are afraid to, to deal with that because it is something that looks like the gray market, something that they don't normally do every day. So that's a good point. I think that that opportunity is, is something that we're going to see more and more of and, you know, leading, leading into my next question with that in mind is you teaching or coaching you mentioned is, is that part of what you're trying to do right now is kind of explain or demystify this type of investing to others. 

 

Chris (27m 58s): Yeah. You said it right. We literally our mission, we have a mission called the kingdom town mission. Our mission is to dominate the, the education field and real estate by helping associates. That's what we deal with. That's what we do deals with. We call them associates by helping them complete 500 deals by 2022, and then we'll rewrite that. But the reason I shared that relative to exactly what you said is so far, we've helped about 1400 families between the deal with the buyer and seller and our students do the deal outside of a bank, right? 

 

It's a lot of families. So then you start affecting them generationally that disruptive market a bit. So we're out on a mission to do that. I know it's a long road. There's only a small percent of younger 20 of these deals that are being done and where we're a tiny fraction of that. But that's where we're going with that because lives are being changed because of it. And you said something about trust. The big thing right now is like, I call it bridging the gap from the time someone does a real estate seminar or course, but when they actually do a deal, some people don't get out of it. I get calls weekly saying I never did a deal. 

 

I follow so-and-so. It's crazy. So, so we don't focus on selling a course. We focus on doing these deals and affecting lives. It's pretty cool. And it's rewarding as heck. 

 

Jesse (29m 9s): Yeah. I, you touched on something great there. And I think there is, I mean, there's oftentimes a analysis paralysis and you have people that listen to podcasts and read books, and it's one thing to, that's all great stuff, but a certain point you got to take action. You don't want to be that guy or gal that three years, you know, you're hearing the same podcast. You're hearing the same people, but you've never actually taken action. 

 

Chris (29m 30s): Yup. So 

 

Jesse (29m 32s): For, I do have just a side question here. You were, again, like I said, you were fortunate to send me, send me the book, wicked smart is I have something to do, set it. Well, I was going to say, so for listeners, I got a shirt and a book, and I was like, you can't look at that shirt and not say wicked smart. You just think so. I think of like Goodwill hunting or a Bostonian accent is that, I mean, it tells a little bit of the background of that you're in Rhode Island right now. So I got to feeling that it's something to do with that. Yeah. 

 

Chris (30m 2s): It's fun. It's yeah. Boston area, wicked smart. We w smart real estate coach was first. And my wife thought of that way back in like 13. We, so we started that. And then we recently trademarked the name. And then, and then the LLC, we changed names to wicked smart. It's our brand. Now the, the, the wicked smart community is all associates. The wicked smart listeners as the podcast list says, it's nothing more than kind of a new England. It don't work because the name was already smart, real estate. 

 

Jesse (30m 29s): Careful here. I've heard a trademark three times here. I've got to be careful. What I put in the show notes. Am I to get a couple of calls from your lawyers? So we, we asked four questions to all the guests that we have on the show before we wrap up. And if you're cool with that, we, we can hit you with those. Then after we'll, we can go over, you know, where people can reach you and a little bit about what we, what we'll be putting in the show notes. Awesome. Okay. Number one, what's something you know, now that you wish 

 

Speaker 2 (30m 57s): You knew at the beginning of your career 

 

Chris (31m 0s): With certainty, the fact that everything you possibly could think of that you want to do, someone's done it. And I know that's easier said than done. I thought that when I was younger, but the only two times I ran into trouble in the rockets and had a tough time. I look back. If he isn't going to realize I didn't have that mental, because I got too cocky. Like I know, and I know literally everything you can think of, it's someone did it go find it and model it 

 

Jesse (31m 23s): Right on ties in nicely to the second question we ask our guests, your view on mentorship for the guys and gals, young and old, what are, what's your take? 

 

Chris (31m 35s): Well, look, I'll give a good example. A direct example. Again, Jesse, we have stuff we can sell people and they can disappear. Never talk to us. It's okay. But the fact is without the hands-on guidance with us or anyone else like that, formula Gabriel, you have three steps. You will leave money on the table. So why not do it more profitable, more, more quickly than the opposite? Why not? It's crazy. So I can attribute. I could pick out in the last 10 years, it'd be at a time I could pick out each mentor I've had in literally attribute for a million million to that particular relationship. 

 

So it's, it's, I couldn't stress that enough. And people say, I can't afford it. Yes, you can. If you simply get resourceful. When I came out of the doldrums of the crash, I found some of that. I said, look, I'm going to crush it with this particular mentor. And as I do deals, I will give you a third or half whatever I told them until you're a hundred percent return on your money. You can get resourceful. If you believe in yourself and your mentor, you can go find the money when it's not certain, 

 

Jesse (32m 33s): For sure another good lead into a resources. So right now, stuff that you've had, you know, whether it's a book, whether it's a podcast, what's a resource you're you're into right now that you'd recommend to, to listeners. 

 

Chris (32m 47s): Okay. Depends on what stage of the business they're at. So it's, so instead of being a general and say, mentor, if you're at a stage where it's at least you and one person on your team, at least two people, and you're at a stage where you're kind of have a goal to get to that seven figure, mark, there's a group I follow still to this day. Since the day I met him at 17. Although he entrepreneurs amazing group, I attribute most of our scaling and success to them. If you're a smaller entrepreneur, solopreneur, it's back to what you and I already talked about. Find someone specifically, that's doing what you're doing and go latch on with them. 

 

Jesse (33m 20s): Great answer. Final question. First car, make and model 

 

Chris (33m 25s): 1978 deep wagon there Jeep wagon ear. 

 

Jesse (33m 31s): I like it right on. Okay, Chris, you've been really generous with your time here for listeners. Where could they find you? What, what can we put in the show notes? 

 

Chris (33m 43s): I just thought of two things, as you were talking, you asked some really cool questions about the book. So one is wicked smart, sorry. Smart realestate coach.com is the main site. So you can hit the webinar there. It's free. You can get a lot of free resources there. I'm big on free. Find out if you want to do this niche, right? Secondly, because you have so many cool questions with the book I tell you what we can do, and my support will love me. But you can put in the show notes, I'll give you the support email. I'll have you want to do it. They can get the hard copy so they can get the hard copy of the new rules and the hard copy of real estate on your terms, we'll mail or our expense. 

 

You won't put a in, we just need an address. So put that in the show notes. And then if they want a free call, there's a really cool strategy expert we have now. And just 18 months ago, he wasn't even in real estate. His name is Brian. And if you've got a smart realestate coach.com forward slash action, you'll get a free strategy call with him. They'll tell you a story and see if it's a fit for you. And you can keep digging free until you decide what you want. 

 

Jesse (34m 38s): My guest today has been Chris Prefontaine, Chris, thanks for being part of working capital. Thanks buddy. Thanks. Pleasure. Thank you so much for listening to working capital the real estate podcast. I'm your host, Jesse for galley. If you liked the episode, head on to iTunes and leave us a five-star review and share on social media, it really helps us out. If you have any questions, feel free to reach out to me on Instagram, Jesse for galley, F R a G a L E, have a good one. 

Take care.